New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby Tetge » Tue Oct 31, 2017 1:08 pm

LMR got their hands on a new 2018, ten speed auto, GT, and did a fake news dyno run on it. The video is on their site and they also just added a short video of how the new adjustable exhaust option sounds. In any case, I said fake news since LMR uses 93 octane and some say additional octane boosters, when they test. They also allege that the car shut down in its 1:1, 7th gear, due to its speed restriction governor, and they did not bother to share any results of a gear change that would allow a full pull to the 7500 RPM redline. Still, the torque figures should compare. The comparison I chose was to the 2015 GT that they tested with the Ford Racing Stage 2, fully CARB and warranty friendly (if installed by a Ford dealer) upgrade, which, runs right about $1000, installed, which is the amount that Ford raised the GT Performace Package on the 2018's by. The torque curves are similar, as are the power curves, up to 6600 RPM. But, one would have to think that Ford did not raise the limiter to 7500 without some reason, so there may be more useful power above 6600 RPM. The Stage 2 raised the limiter from 6700 to 7200, and the word on the street is to rev as close to 7200 as possible for max performance, so it is sort of tricky to determine if power goes up substantially for the 2018. If it does, it will have a definite flat spot in its power curve from 5500 RPM 6600 RPM. Also note is the fact that the new 10 speed auto is 1:1 in 7th gear, which means that the 10 speed auto has two more gears to use in the 1/4, which, combined with the claimed lightning shifts of the auto in drag mode, is a giant advantage, even for a heavier car. I expect that the advantages of an auto when drag racing, along with more gears, will make the new GT a stout performer, so, a good road test of a 6 speed manual would be interesting to see at some point.

Not that any of that is of any interest to me at this point, as I am fully retired from drag racing. But, it is still true that torque rules in ordinary driving as it is uncommon for high performance machines to hit their redlines, in everyday street use, but, torque is used all the time. This is one reason that smaller turbo engines have gained so much ground, as they generate lots of useful torque for their displacement, and most have humble redlines.

But, I still like the sound and feel of that big inch V8 effortless torque that a good old naturally aspirated American V8 delivers, and, Mustang is still offering that, albeit at elevated prices, if you want all the performance goodies.

Here is the comparison:

Compare_15_18.jpg
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby jhwalker » Tue Oct 31, 2017 4:14 pm

Would you pay to get those piss-ant gains? Slap a blower on and get a real (even if illegal) increase. :whistle: :whistle:
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby Tetge » Tue Oct 31, 2017 6:25 pm

jhwalker wrote:Would you pay to get those piss-ant gains? Slap a blower on and get a real (even if illegal) increase. :whistle: :whistle:


Any gain that is factory issued and preserves the entire new car warranty and is CARB approved is worth a bit of coin, only if it is only a minor HP/TQ gain. But, the main mechanical reason that I like the Stage 2 mod is that it raises the rev limiter to 7200 RPM, from the low stock 6700 RPM, which allows about 7.5% more headroom in each gear, and with improved intake and a better tune it is easy to hit the limiter in 1st, as 1st has a stump puller 13.678:1 overall reduction with the 3.73 Performance Package diff. A gear that only goes 40 in a 400 HP vehicle, pulling about 10 pounds/RWHP, is a mighty short gear. In comparison, the Terminators had a 9.443:1 overall first gear ratio. So, hitting the redline, accidentally, can happen, and a +7.5% gain in the redline is beneficial.

I have to also add that I have been down the add supercharger route with a '93 GT, so, I know better. It is no accident that I have sworn off unauthorized mods.
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby jhwalker » Tue Oct 31, 2017 7:13 pm

Tetge wrote:
jhwalker wrote:Would you pay to get those piss-ant gains? Slap a blower on and get a real (even if illegal) increase. :whistle: :whistle:


Any gain that is factory issued and preserves the entire new car warranty and is CARB approved is worth a bit of coin, only if it is only a minor HP/TQ gain. But, the main mechanical reason that I like the Stage 2 mod is that it raises the rev limiter to 7200 RPM, from the low stock 6700 RPM, which allows about 7.5% more headroom in each gear, and with improved intake and a better tune it is easy to hit the limiter in 1st, as 1st has a stump puller 13.678:1 overall reduction with the 3.73 Performance Package diff. A gear that only goes 40 in a 400 HP vehicle, pulling about 10 pounds/RWHP, is a mighty short gear. In comparison, the Terminators had a 9.443:1 overall first gear ratio. So, hitting the redline, accidentally, can happen, and a +7.5% gain in the redline is beneficial.

I have to also add that I have been down the add supercharger route with a '93 GT, so, I know better. It is no accident that I have sworn off unauthorized mods.


uh, ok I'm sure that there have been no improvements since 1993. If you are happy, I am happy. :clap:
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby Tetge » Tue Oct 31, 2017 10:23 pm

It is not about HP for me, at this stage of my life, and with plenty of modifying and racing behind me. I want the full factory warranty and smog compliance, and, cost is also a consideration. Ford Racing offers an intercooled 12# supercharger kit for 2015-2017 Mustangs for a bit over $7000. If it is installed by an authorized Ford dealer, they give a limited one year supercharger warranty if certain age of vehicle and mileage requirements are met. It is CARB 50 state legal, but not so warranty friendly, and, it is a pretty intrusive install, so,you can bet that the install could be $1500, or more. After you add $8500-$9000, on top of the initial $40K, or more, Mustang, you might find the price of 670 alleged HP (on 93 octane), pretty high, particularly since you might never need that much power, and, the car's transmission is known to be a weak link, along with the stock half shafts. And, no matter what, an add on supercharger adds a level of complexity that was not engineered into the car, no matter how well thought out it is.

So, if added power is not going to be used, it makes no sense to spend big and radically alter a machine to create more power. Usually it is easier and more cost effective, long term, to get a more powerful machine in the first place.
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby jhwalker » Wed Nov 01, 2017 5:25 am

What half-shaft failures :?: The new tranny is failing? I missed those reports. IYH, IH... :-D
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby Tetge » Wed Nov 01, 2017 10:39 am

jhwalker wrote:What half-shaft failures :?: The new tranny is failing? I missed those reports. IYH, IH... :-D


Plenty of reports about weak manual transmissions in the 2015-2017's. 3rd gear is the culprit in most cases. And, Ford Racing makes heavy duty half shafts, as the stock ones can fail, just as the ones in the SVT Cobra could. In normal service these components should perform OK, but, drag racing can put serious loads on drive trains, as some of us learned, and threw considerable money at, by actual experience. All the extra power and torque of an aftermarket supercharger can not possible improve things as far as the stock drive train goes. And, as indicated, the stock engine still will blow away the tires at launch and on the 1->2 up shift. So, unless a person is into auto shows, or roll racing, or the Mojave Mile, all that extra HP is not an amenity.

Of course, in my case, if i want very snappy performance and the ability to rule urban traffic, I just hop on my KTM. People can have monster cages, but, I can split lanes, and I do not even have to break pace to pass cages and other traffic even on tight canyon roads. If you are an old motorcyclist, cages really are a second choice most of the time when it comes to spirited street motoring. And, Southern California, smoggy and crowded and all, still is one of the great motorcycling spots in the entire world.

I also am not just arguing a point, since each new Mustang I have purchased since the Terminator has been one full second in the 1/4 slower than the vehicle immediately proceeding it. The Terminator went 11.4's. The 2012 auto went 12.4's and the 2017 goes 13.4's, or worse. I also stepped away from a Hayabusa and spent 6 years on a 34 HP. 398cc, supermoto. And, the 690 Duke is only a 690cc single, and tops out at 112 mph on the 8000 RPM rev limiter in its top, 6th, gear. It is snappy at lower speeds due to light curb weight (350 pounds fully fueled) but it is no superbike. Naturally, perceptions of what vehicles should offer, differ widely, but, I will stand on my record and I will still maintain that HP is not all that, after being there and doing that.
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby jhwalker » Wed Nov 01, 2017 10:45 am

You are gonna make me, the old guy, search? Linkies, por favor.
I'm off-line until tomorrow I think. Day of the Dead festivities are commencing. :dance:
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby Tetge » Wed Nov 01, 2017 11:07 am

jhwalker wrote:You are gonna make me, the old guy, search? Linkies, por favor.
I'm off-line until tomorrow I think. Day of the Dead festivities are commencing. :dance:


I have no links, but, there are posts and info out there. It does not concern me since I always granny shift and the OEM, P-Zeros, have no traction in a straight line, so they put no loads on the drive train. I also never bother to turn the nannies off, as with the GT Performance Package, the nannies are calibrated to allow more than sufficient performance for my reformed driving style. In fact, looking for suitable turnout to get out of the way of traffic is my biggest concern these days, as I hate being one of those drivers that I used to loath, that makes a rolling road block by virtuously running along close to the posted speed limit, which, in LA, is 10-15 mph slower that most traffic.
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Re: New for 2018 Level 2 GT Performance Pack

Postby Tetge » Thu Nov 02, 2017 8:46 am

More fake news on the 2018 Mustang GT, and they even made a fake video to support the fake news. I was impressed with the fake rain that they used to cover up the fact that they did not test thoroughly enough to run a fake 11 (on the stock Performance Package Michelin's). But, as anticipated, the 10 speed auto, and its drag mode nannies, apparently helped lay down the Coyote power. But, 12.02? Off an alleged 1.9x, 60' time? Even on what ever octane they pumped into the car, that is impressive. A fake 116.94 mph trap speed is also very impressive. Good work with their video editing.

They also weighed the car, fully fueled on a cert scale without driver and it was 3860 pounds, and, their car is the base model and not loaded with features. The Premium trim model must be well over 3900 pounds, so, one price of the new loaded with tech model is that it is fatter than ever.

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